Tuesday, 28 April 2015

On leaking sinks and SMEV traps

Clipped from a Classic Hymers Facebook thread 

I have a leak under the sink which appears to be a perished O-ring.Where can I find an approx 6.5cm O ring to replace it,just returned from trawling the shops to no avail? Thanks

  • George Burrowes likes this.
  • Mike Backhouse Have you got a picture? I get my stuff off eBay.
  • Samantha Barfoot It is just a black rubber O ring, its the size thats awkward.Going to look on e bay now though, thanks.
  • Mike Backhouse I only asked because 6.5cm equates to 2.5 inches that's a large diameter pipe for a motorhome sink.
  • Neil Geldart If you cannot find the right one in any hardware store try somewhere that fixes washing machines or a plumbers merchant. The important thing about o-rings is to get the right material thickness for a seal, if you have to buy much bigger diameter but similar thickness cut out whats needed with a very sharp knife and re-join with super glue
  • Terry Martin Bearing factors or engineers supplier
  • Samantha Barfoot Thanks for your help, its for the waste under the sink. I can find them on e bay but all sent from Hong Kong so a long while to wait.........
  • Steve Cooper Try pertex the hydrolic people
  • Andy Healey I have just ordered some for my car and used this chart to get the right size. The BS reference can then be used to search ebay

    supaseal.co.uk/datasheets/bs_or_sizes.pdf
  • David Sanderson when i worked in the steel industry we had * O * ring kits long length of * O * ring material razor blade and super glue get the right dia but larger and cut to size and superglue works every time.
  • David Olley Because I was unable to source a 60mm 'O' ring locally last week, the local tractor supplier gave me a length of the rubber of the correct diameter so that I could make a couple using the method explained by David Sanderson. Always useful to have some in the ditty box!
  • Ron Bentham Do you mean the O ring that seals the plastic trap under the sink plug - the one that has a plastic screw off cover? If so it's a Smev part, as it's an integral part of the trap.
  • Mike Backhouse Picture worth a thousand words 
  • Samantha Barfoot Yes Ron Bentham, thats it. Smev, do they supply it?Or do I have to order through Brownhills or somewhere?
  • Samantha Barfoot Just googled it Ron Bentham, and still none the wiser! I am assuming thats why water is leaking from under the sink, have taken it apart and it looks worn.I am hoping that is the answer! Now I just need to find how to buy a replacement! Cheers
  • Samantha Barfoot Its under the sink, a plastic trap with a screw off bottom, its leaking from there.
  • Ron Bentham does your screw off bottom look like the one in this photo?
    http://leisurelines.net/smev-2-outlet-trap-sink-waste...
    Motorhome Camper Caravan Accessories Spare Parts...
  • Samantha Barfoot Yes, the very bottom white screw off part, the O ring sits inside and is about 65mm with a 2.5mm thickness.
  • Samantha Barfoot I have ordered some on Amazon, just general O rings, hopefully will do the trick.Just have to put a pan under it until they arrive!
  • Ron Bentham I had this problem, years ago....I couldn't find the seal then either. And it kept leaking no matter what I did. I ended up sealing the whole thing back on with silicone. Now it is fixed in place, and I have a spare waiting for when it eventually needs replacing. I think you have two choices - either carry on trying to source an O ring, or make one from a kit, or just replace the whole thing - as you can see the whole thing is under a tenner....the one I linked was the first I found - it has a double outlet, but I am sure we can find another What do you think?
  • Samantha Barfoot I cant quite understand why it is leaking. I noticed it as water had seeped under the lino ! I have ordered the O rings so hopefully they might do the trick.I have tried to use PTE plumbing tape as well, no luck .... I will have a look tomorrow.I think maybe I have to replace it, or as you did, seal it up, might be the easiest as it looks a fiddly bugger to replace! I am assuming this is the cause of water between the old lino layers.Unless there are other places I need to check for leakages.......I cant replace the flooring until I find out exactly where the leak is.....
  • Ron Bentham well make sure you know where its coming from - it could also be the compression fittings that clamp the whole thing to the sink hole. Wipe it bone dry with a tissue, fill the sink, and then get in there with a strong light and pinpoint the leak. It could also be the waste pipe fittings....and unless you are sure where it is coming from, take a look at where the waste pipes drop into the waste tank - they are all press fittings and can vibrate loose. I had a leak there last year - took me ages to track it down.
  • Neil Elliott Got the same problem here but couldn't source a new smev trap, until now thanks to Ron Bentham .
    If your problem is the same as mine, its not the "O" ring as i found a hairline crack across the middle of the actual disc itself. Have a good look and try prodding around with your fingers.
  • Samantha Barfoot Hello Ron Bentham, thanks for your help.Do I need to get under the van to locate where the waste pipe drops into the tank or get the floor up?
  • Ron Bentham Well I don't know your van - the pipes drop into the waste tank on the top front edge of the tank. The pipes from the bathroom and the kitchen are routed, usually with other wires and pipes etc, and then they go through a hole in the floor, through a standard plastic push fit elbow and down into the tank. So the place to look is along where the front of the tank is level with. It is usually covered by a piece of wood, which needs unscrewing. But before you do that, look for signs of wet - if it's bone dry with no signs of seepage, look elsewhere.

    Mine was a crazy leak - it only ever happened when the van was parked nose down, which is rare - any other time the leak just dribbled harmlessly outside down the front of the tank. I am not saying this is your problem Samantha...just work logically back from the sink! Check the bathroom waste as well - if you have wet patches under your floor coverings igt could be creeping from anywhere.
  • Ron Bentham Neil yes I was going to mention that. The old style Smev traps are getting hard to find. The new ones don't have a trap, and let the waste go straight down to the tank. They must have done this for a reason....I would suspect that it must have been due to feedback from dealers and customers - the traps easily get gunged up and can smell. It's a disgusting job. So doing away with the trap, and letting the bits go straight into the tank is sort of logical, as it will take an age for it to become a problem in a big tank, and when it does you just blast it with chemicals and loads of rinse water.
    Anybody else close to the trade know why?
  • Samantha Barfoot Hi Ron Bentham, I am also wondering if it is when parked at a certain angle! I will investigate soon, just waiting for my rubber O rings in the hope it may be that simple(ha,ha)! I am also dreading lifting off the floor coverings, they are pretty gross, layer upon layer! Will let you know of progress.
  • Samantha Barfoot Aha, this was the thread! Appears the new washer has stopped the leak......fingers crossed.
    2 hrs · Like
  • Christian Skeels All things are relative. One of my boat repair jobs was replacing a vital valve in a blocked marine toilet on a passing German cruising yacht. Sink traps hold no fear for me!! The name of the valve - a joker valve! I wasn't laughing!
    1 hr · Like
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Monday, 27 April 2015

Trav-l-cool evaporative aircon units as fitted to many 90's Hymers

Just got up on th roof and noticed a considerable hole in the air conditioning unit. Is it fixable? Does it matter? Not tested the air con yet so don't even know if it works.

Victoria Grey's photo.
Victoria Grey's photo.
  • Ron Bentham This is a TravlCool evaporative aircon unit. It works on the principle of water evaporation as opposed to refrigeration as found in cars and houses. It works on the same principle as when you spray cold water on your skin in summer and then blow on it you feel a cooling effect. Somewhere in the van there will be a plastic container with tubes leading from it to the unit on the roof. This is the water reservoir and if you are unlucky it will be half full of rancid old water!
    I also have one of these units on my van, and I must be honest they are not really much good. It does provide some cooling effect in reasonably hot weather but when you get to a really hot climates say 30° or more it really doesn't perform. It is also power hungry and noisy and needs constant maintenance.

    The hole in it looks to be cosmetic damage caused by a low flying tree or similar. It should patch up quite easily and you should at least attempt a temporary repair otherwise you will find birds and other creatures making it their home eventually!

    I suggest you give the unit and its water tank a good clean and then see how you get on with it over the summer. The problem is that if you take it out you will be left with a hole in your roof.

    If you don't have the instruction manual for it in your document pack either I will find a copy online for you are you can have a copy of mine.
  • Victoria Grey Thank you. I've just found the rancid water! I'll attempt a repair job. No animals yet. I doubt we'll use it at all but it's nice to have just in case.
  • Ron Bentham Give the vents a good vac ..... they have a nasty habit of blowing acculutaed crap into the van the first time you switch it on after storage!
  • Victoria Grey Good tip, thank you.
  • Ron Bentham also a few drops of bleach stops the water going rancid - but don't overdo it otherwise the van smells like a freshly cleaned toilet!
  • Mark Burchell If you do decide to take the unit off it might be worth installing an omni fan or similar if the aperture is the right size or smaller...
  • Linda Grant Ron Bentham could we have a copy of your manual please? Thinking about recommissioning ours dependant on effort & cost.... Looks like the tube & water have been taken away, but the power supply still works.
  • Josef Williams There is a water jack under my sink with two pipe's and a witch for a water pump the water in the jack is blue i'v not checked it but i think it's antifreeze I'v cleaned it all up and had it running but not used it for any length of time.
  • Ron Bentham Linda - I finally found it but it's in German! I had a good Google around and found a pdf online....and also one in Dutch, but there's not a sniff of an English version. I suggest you try this online one and do the Google translate thing!
    https://www.gebruikershandleiding.com/.../preview...
    Bekijk en download hier de handleiding van Industrial...
  • Victoria Grey I've got an English one. I'll try and scan it.
  • Josef Williams Thank you Ron Bentham Trav-l- Cool is the same has main pump is different .
  • Roger Godwin I have one of these units fitted on my S700. Never found any drain tubbing or water container though. Any chance of a copy of your English instruction booklet Victoria. Willing to pay. Or would it be possible to upload it to the Group files for all.
    Thank you.
  • Victoria Grey Just trying to find it now. I've got too much paperwork! I'll upload it as soon as I do 
  • Linda Grant Thanks Ron, thanks Victoria - we found some tubing in the wardrobe but it stops abruptly - I'd like to know where to put a water container 9if we do) and how it all works....
  • Peter Curry drain tube from aircon needs to run outside of van, the damage can be repaired it is just the outer weather case but does need doing before traveling too far as wind will rip it to bits once it has a toe hold, a good clean and some fiperglass repair matt job done
    21 hrs · Like · 1
  • Ron Bentham Well Linda..... My aircon unit has been the least useful of the extras on my S700. My tank is fitted in the void under the wardrobe floor, behind the heater - yes you read that right - I have to take out the wardrobe floor to fill the tank! The tank is a standard plastic container with a screw top, about 10 litres ish .... the top is modified to allow the two tubes to pass through. One tube is the feed tube that goes down to the bottom of the tank, with a small filter on it, and the other is the drain tube, which, contrary to what peter says (in my case) drains return water back into the tank. The main tube goes from the tank to a pump that is monted on the wall between the wardrobe and the kitchen cupboards, and then up to the aircon unit.
    The best think I can say about it is that it works, but having to do the wardrobe floor to fill the tank proved to be a real pain. One day in Portugal I had a brainwave - I drilled a hole in the bottom of the tank and ran a clear plastic tube to the outside which is tacked vertically to the wood panel situated between the left hand side of the heater, and the under sink kitchen cupboard - photo on request. This then gave me a visual indication oif the water level - similar to the tubes you see on big external heating oil tanks to indicate their level.
    Of course the top of the tube is above the level of the top of the tank - otherwise disaster!
    I then rigged an attachment to the shower fitting which enabled me to direct water from the shower into the top of the tube - thus taking away the need to take out the floor. I was quite pleased with my contraption, and i got some decent use out of the unit during my long trips round Portugal, Spain and Morocco a few years back.
    It was with heavy use that I discovered it's other drawback - if you have it on full for a long time it occasionally drips water onto the floor below - no big deal as the water is clean. It is also noisy on full, and not so effective on low.
    Unfortunately the intervening years have seen the plastic level pipe discolour with scale and bacteria, so it now looks quite disgusting and needs replacing - I believe a few drops of bleach would keep it clean - would have to experiment as too much would smell, and too little would be useless.
    Ideally the tank needs to be more accessible - in the boot is the obvious choice, but routing of the pipes might be difficult. 
    So you need to see where your pipes are, and also do you still have the pump?
    4 hrs · Like
  • Peter Curry Ha but what you describe Ron is not a air con unit but a perigee effect cool air humidifier
    4 hrs · Like
  • Linda Grant Hi Ron - splendid detailed answer as always thank you! Yes we need to hunt down the ends of the pipes (didn't think to look underneath the wardrobe floor - there's a safe on top of that now so that won't be a 5 minute job!) - I've no idea if we still have a pump. I'm guessing a pump wouldn't cost much though, I'm wondering if we could bypass all that work & install a new water container and pump somewhere more accessible? Although a 10 litre container is much bigger than i had visualised, and tbh that would take up valuable packing space. I was thinking it would be a little tub like a margarine tub or something. It's low down our priority list, I just saw Victoria's post and was reminded. Is there any chance that this entire conversation thread could be filed in the group files so I can come back to it in a few months? 
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